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Let's talk about spelling.
Let's talk about spelling.
Let's start with the orgasmic moan, because we all know that's why you clicked the cut. Except expand that to not only about moan, but all sounds made during sex. Expand that further to not only sex sounds, but any sounds made at any time that don't really have real letter representations: the moan, the groan, the grunt, the scream, the cry, the cheer, the tsk, the huff--whatever else you can think of.
1. What are your thoughts on writing out those sounds?
For instance, would you prefer to see Angel moaned Or, "Uhh," Angel moaned in text? Does it really make a difference? For me, it does. I hate to write out moans, and generally I don't like to see them because no matter how you spell them, moans don't sound like letters. Then again, in rare instances, especially in smut, a moan written out affects me more than just being told someone moaned, becuase, like dialogue, it is more immediate.
2. Now, how do you spell them?
We've got some traditional spellings: "ugh", "humph", "ah", "aw", "aiee", "uh", "mm", "harrumph", "ahem", "eh" and "oh". Are these spellings modifiable? For instance, I rarely make the sound, "Humph." It's more like a "hmph"--but dictionary.com doesn't have that. And yet, it's pretty easy to decipher my meaning and imagine the sound.
a. But what if we start more complex modifications, such as writing out a moan during sex, which is is more often "Uhhghnn" than "Uh"? Maybe "Uhhghnn" is a rather neat letter representation that you can actually relate to, but what about, "Uhhhghahhhnnnnoh!" Can you imagine that sound? Would you want to read it in a fic? At what point does it start to look stupid, rather than add an element of realism?
b. How many letters can you add to one of these words--is there a limit? I find, "Mmmmmmmmmm" to be very annoying in text, because "Mmm" conveys the meaning without looking ridiculous. But to me, that visual aspect of the text is something that can pull me right out of a fic. And anyway, do people really "Uhhhhhhhhhhhhh" for that long?
c. How do you differentiate? "Ah" can mean a sound of realization, as in "ah ha!" But it can also be soothing. "She's rubbing my back. Ahhh." Or it can be a scream. "Vampires. Ahh!" (And notice my addition of letters. Is the difference between reliation "ah" and soothing "ahh" an extra "h"? Same with "oh". There's a realization: "Oh, I get it," and a wonderment, "oooh, pretty fireworks". And I've seen people use "ugh" as an expression of disgust and a sound of pleasure. Do they really sound the same?
Now, technically the above words, such as "ugh", are interjections (any member of a class of words expressing emotion," dictionary.com). But I differentiate from noise words (the above) to words we say. (Sometimes they overlap. "Tsk", I think, can both be a sound and a word you say.) I mean words such as "yuck!", "ow!", "oops!", et al. And there's a level up of interjection from that, words that aren't exclamations, such as, "yeah".
3. Uh-huh, uh-uh. What the hell do they mean? And how do we spell them?
I hate to see these words in text. To me, "uh-huh" means an affirmative, and "uh-uh" means a negative. But I've seen people jumble them up until I don't know which is which. And yet, I use them in text too, because there's nothing quite like "uh-huh"--the laziest, most not committed, non attentive kind of affirmative. And what about "nuh-uh"?
4. whoa.
This is where it begins to get complicated. The reason I did this post is that sometimes I'm aggravated by the feeling that certain interjections are mispelled, and I want to correct people. For instance, some people spell this word, "woah" and it drives me ABSOLUTE BONKERS. Then I begin to question myself. I can't spell a moan, and to me, "hmph" is a perfectly valid thing to write in text. How do I know how to spell, "whoa"? dictionary.com has it, and does not have "woah". But this dictionary only has "whoa" in the context of when the word used to mean "stop" (as in, a command to stop a horse). It doesn't have the other more contemporary, slang usages of "whoa". Is there a right and a wrong way to spell this word? Is it, in fact, more of a noise word, with which you can take liberties without alienating readers?
5. yeah, yea, and yay.
This is my biggest pet peeve of all, and yet, I don't think I--or possibly anyone else--really has the authority to put the smackdown on those who use "yea" in a way that makes me ITCH. According to dictionary.com, "yea" is pronounce "yey"--as in, rhymes with "hay," what horses eat--as in, same word as "yay!" a word you use when you're happy to get something, or the word you use to delineate size "when I was yay big"). Now, the meaning of "yea" is yes, and back in the day, it was probably used colloquially. But nowadays, people use "yeah", pronounced as "yah", rhymes with the "ma" sound in the word "mad". But dictionary.com doesn't have that pronounciation, and who's to say how "yeah" is really spelled? I've seen "ya" (which always strikes me as ja, as in German) and "yah", both of which look wrong to me).
I could google around and try to find the "right" answer; I could examine other dictionaries, including those that some consider the "final authority" (e.g., the OED)--but I'm not interested in that so much as how it strikes you in fic/writing/text. I've seen smart people who's writing and intelligence and rudimentary knowledge of such things I respect using "yea" when I think they should be using "yeah" in great, beautiful, grammatically perfect fic. So, what gives? Should this not bother me? Do you feel there's a right or wrong answer to things like this? What do you feel that answer is?
6. Lastly, there's just something I want to throw out there about what I see as "newer" interjections. "Whoa" evolved from the "stop" command to mean something else, nowadays (though it can still mean "stop"). But are other interjections being created? I see "gah" around all the time now, and never used to. It's not in dictionary.com. And "guh".
7. What about "internet" words? What about "glomp"? Didn't "squick" evolve from internet usage? Is it weird to have a character say something like that in a fic?
8. How do you pronounce, "eh?"
Let's start with the orgasmic moan, because we all know that's why you clicked the cut. Except expand that to not only about moan, but all sounds made during sex. Expand that further to not only sex sounds, but any sounds made at any time that don't really have real letter representations: the moan, the groan, the grunt, the scream, the cry, the cheer, the tsk, the huff--whatever else you can think of.
1. What are your thoughts on writing out those sounds?
For instance, would you prefer to see Angel moaned Or, "Uhh," Angel moaned in text? Does it really make a difference? For me, it does. I hate to write out moans, and generally I don't like to see them because no matter how you spell them, moans don't sound like letters. Then again, in rare instances, especially in smut, a moan written out affects me more than just being told someone moaned, becuase, like dialogue, it is more immediate.
2. Now, how do you spell them?
We've got some traditional spellings: "ugh", "humph", "ah", "aw", "aiee", "uh", "mm", "harrumph", "ahem", "eh" and "oh". Are these spellings modifiable? For instance, I rarely make the sound, "Humph." It's more like a "hmph"--but dictionary.com doesn't have that. And yet, it's pretty easy to decipher my meaning and imagine the sound.
a. But what if we start more complex modifications, such as writing out a moan during sex, which is is more often "Uhhghnn" than "Uh"? Maybe "Uhhghnn" is a rather neat letter representation that you can actually relate to, but what about, "Uhhhghahhhnnnnoh!" Can you imagine that sound? Would you want to read it in a fic? At what point does it start to look stupid, rather than add an element of realism?
b. How many letters can you add to one of these words--is there a limit? I find, "Mmmmmmmmmm" to be very annoying in text, because "Mmm" conveys the meaning without looking ridiculous. But to me, that visual aspect of the text is something that can pull me right out of a fic. And anyway, do people really "Uhhhhhhhhhhhhh" for that long?
c. How do you differentiate? "Ah" can mean a sound of realization, as in "ah ha!" But it can also be soothing. "She's rubbing my back. Ahhh." Or it can be a scream. "Vampires. Ahh!" (And notice my addition of letters. Is the difference between reliation "ah" and soothing "ahh" an extra "h"? Same with "oh". There's a realization: "Oh, I get it," and a wonderment, "oooh, pretty fireworks". And I've seen people use "ugh" as an expression of disgust and a sound of pleasure. Do they really sound the same?
Now, technically the above words, such as "ugh", are interjections (any member of a class of words expressing emotion," dictionary.com). But I differentiate from noise words (the above) to words we say. (Sometimes they overlap. "Tsk", I think, can both be a sound and a word you say.) I mean words such as "yuck!", "ow!", "oops!", et al. And there's a level up of interjection from that, words that aren't exclamations, such as, "yeah".
3. Uh-huh, uh-uh. What the hell do they mean? And how do we spell them?
I hate to see these words in text. To me, "uh-huh" means an affirmative, and "uh-uh" means a negative. But I've seen people jumble them up until I don't know which is which. And yet, I use them in text too, because there's nothing quite like "uh-huh"--the laziest, most not committed, non attentive kind of affirmative. And what about "nuh-uh"?
4. whoa.
This is where it begins to get complicated. The reason I did this post is that sometimes I'm aggravated by the feeling that certain interjections are mispelled, and I want to correct people. For instance, some people spell this word, "woah" and it drives me ABSOLUTE BONKERS. Then I begin to question myself. I can't spell a moan, and to me, "hmph" is a perfectly valid thing to write in text. How do I know how to spell, "whoa"? dictionary.com has it, and does not have "woah". But this dictionary only has "whoa" in the context of when the word used to mean "stop" (as in, a command to stop a horse). It doesn't have the other more contemporary, slang usages of "whoa". Is there a right and a wrong way to spell this word? Is it, in fact, more of a noise word, with which you can take liberties without alienating readers?
5. yeah, yea, and yay.
This is my biggest pet peeve of all, and yet, I don't think I--or possibly anyone else--really has the authority to put the smackdown on those who use "yea" in a way that makes me ITCH. According to dictionary.com, "yea" is pronounce "yey"--as in, rhymes with "hay," what horses eat--as in, same word as "yay!" a word you use when you're happy to get something, or the word you use to delineate size "when I was yay big"). Now, the meaning of "yea" is yes, and back in the day, it was probably used colloquially. But nowadays, people use "yeah", pronounced as "yah", rhymes with the "ma" sound in the word "mad". But dictionary.com doesn't have that pronounciation, and who's to say how "yeah" is really spelled? I've seen "ya" (which always strikes me as ja, as in German) and "yah", both of which look wrong to me).
I could google around and try to find the "right" answer; I could examine other dictionaries, including those that some consider the "final authority" (e.g., the OED)--but I'm not interested in that so much as how it strikes you in fic/writing/text. I've seen smart people who's writing and intelligence and rudimentary knowledge of such things I respect using "yea" when I think they should be using "yeah" in great, beautiful, grammatically perfect fic. So, what gives? Should this not bother me? Do you feel there's a right or wrong answer to things like this? What do you feel that answer is?
6. Lastly, there's just something I want to throw out there about what I see as "newer" interjections. "Whoa" evolved from the "stop" command to mean something else, nowadays (though it can still mean "stop"). But are other interjections being created? I see "gah" around all the time now, and never used to. It's not in dictionary.com. And "guh".
7. What about "internet" words? What about "glomp"? Didn't "squick" evolve from internet usage? Is it weird to have a character say something like that in a fic?
8. How do you pronounce, "eh?"
no subject
As to orgasmic moaning: I am fairly against the practice of writing out moans. I think it's redundant. I do, however, write things like... "A sound emerged from the back of her throat; langorous and low, and capable of leaving small fires in it's wake", or, if I'm feeling less... colorful, I'll say something like, "A low sound broke from her lips, sounding somewhere between a moan and a sigh."
I generally prefer to leave the 'moaning' up to other writers, though, in it's entirety. I think a talented writer can do so much better that falling back on those old stand-in terms.
"yeah, yea, and yay."
Ooooh, these ones get on my nerves. People use them incorrectly all of the time. To my knowledge, 'yeah', pertains to a statement like, 'yeah, I understand', 'yea' is some archaic word that I'll probably never use unless I decide to write a fantasy, so I could care less about it, and 'yay' is "Yay, I won the lottery!'. If you read fanfiction, however, they all mean each other and vice versa. Hmph.
I suppose I sound like I've got my own little soapbox, and I'm never coming down... but I really think that in order to be a writer one must strive to be literate. And well-read. Well-read people find it easier to use these terms correctly simply because they see them used correctly on a regular basis.
Internet words are... well, it's a constant battle with me. I hatehatehate the whole LOL, LMFAO, ROGL thing. It drives me CRAZY. But I use 'guh' and 'gah' and things like *runs away smirking* all the time. It's my inner hypocrite coming to the surface. ;) <-- and yes, I do tend to crack out on the winking smiley face thing. Shame on me!
Laastly, I pronounce 'eh' like an old man would, saying "I'm sorry sonny, what was that? I couldn't quite make it out; my hearing is lamentable." Only, you know, simplified.
no subject
They are many. Legion, in fact.
no subject
Which is part of what I mean--communication like this takes place at a much faster rate, and I do not feel that it should be perfect, or as limited as something like a published work. I do find that correct capatalization and basic sentence structure makes reading comments easier, but should it be combed for punctuation errors; should we seek to explain the feelings behind *hugs* rather than just write "*hugs*" when we want to hug someone? I don't feel that way.
Oh em gee I'm long winded.
no subject
It drives me bonkers too, but there's no point in trying to tell people who do it wrong any different, so far as I can tell. That's something I'll assume people learned in school, and if they didn't learn it there, and haven't figured it out since, I doubt no matter how much a either patiently con crit--or flame--that they'll change their habits. Heh. I almost just used the wrong "their"!
I think a talented writer can do so much better that falling back on those old stand-in terms.
I think so, too.
People use them incorrectly all of the time.
Right there with you, sister--but the way people fuck them up so much, and the way they use stuff like "ya" and "yah", I wonder who it is that really gets to put their foot down about that kind of thing.
Internet words are... well, it's a constant battle with me. I hatehatehate the whole LOL, LMFAO, ROGL thing. It drives me CRAZY. But I use 'guh' and 'gah' and things like *runs away smirking* all the time.
lol! ha, sorry. But not really! No, I use stuff like that in posts and comments all the time, just because I'm way too lazy to write out something like, "Your comment has amused me tremendously and has actually caused me to emit sound in a silent room", you know? I use whatever I can--asterisks and funny pictures and stupid smiley faces--especially smiley faces, because a joke is so much harder to understand online, and so is "no hard feelings".
In most fic, and in original writing, one shouldn't have to use those because one should be able to write well enough to convey what each word means with the basic textual tools (I would add though that a work that is specifically working to subvert those tools with enough thematic reasons to back that subersion up would be excepted, of course). One creates all the elements of that world and should be able to present those elements with a clear meaning. But comments and posts are interactive; you do not create all the elements and nor control them all, and so I feel like miscommunication is far more likely to occur (especially considering the speed with which these things take place). What I'm trying to say in my long convoluted way is that I believe such communication is made far easier by--yes, by thingies like smiley faces. ;o)
no subject
Agreed. Unless the story is being portrayed in a non-standard format, ie: emails or letters, I don't think anyone should EVER see the term LOL in fic. It's atrocious. I love slang, and use it liberally, but mostly in dialogue. Or if I'm writing from a person's POV that uses a lot of slang. Or if, you know, it's pertinent to the story's telling. But the use of slang, and terms like LOL, etc... are place specific. One definetely shouldn't write something like, 'She LOLed.'. I don't think I've ever seen it done in fic, but if I did... well, that writer would have to go on my blacklist. I would probably be unable to read anything by them ever again. Because I'm stubborn, and also pernickity. (I really just wanted to use the word pernickity, even though I think the spelling is wrong..) ;)