Fandom far afield

[lettered]

When was the last time you participated in fandom on the internet not through a journaling site? I don't really mean posting fanfic to something like fanfiction.net, unless you also post and discuss in the forums there. I mean discussion, meta, the posting of fanfic, the making of graphics, etc, all being share through a medium other than LJ, DW, Insane Journal, JournalFen, etc. This would be a forum, website, mailing list . . . if you did something like a fanzine, not online, I'm interested in that too.

1) What fandom was it?
2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
3) When was this?
4) Are you still active in that fandom?
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
11) Which medium do you prefer?

If it sounds like I'm doing a study, I'm not. I'm just dabbling around in this other fandom, the fen of which seems mainly to congregate around a forum rather than playing on LJ/DW. I'm wondering how many people share my experiences there. Forums used to be my main method of fandom access. I was comfortable in them and found LJ inconvenient and not very suited to my style. I became used to it because I decided a lot of cool people were here...and now I'm beginning to think it's the only way!

Comments

[kenaressa.livejournal.com]

My Kanjani8 fandom mainly uses a forum...I'm kinda bad about keeping up with it though.....although that isn't all that different with how I am at posting here ^^;

I got into that forum by meeting some of the people in person and I was already in the fandom, though not active online....so it doesn't fit the other questions.

No real difference in the people here and the people there (some of them are here too) but I'm more active on lj (for various qualities of active). I think it's just easier to check because of the list format.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Yeah, LJ's definitely easier to check. At first I thought it was crazy, keeping up with your flist. I...still think it's crazy, but it's easier than keeping up with a forum!

[flake-sake.livejournal.com]

1) BtVS
2) A forum
3) today
4) yes
5) I participate both on boards and on journaling sites and I think both places have their advantages and flaws. On journaling sites you can go into more intricate complex discussions about controversial points in the show, also it's great for posting ans reading fanfiction. But it is easy to get caught in just your preferred corner of fandom, while on the boards you'll find a broader range of opinions, which is good but also leads to more controversy, which undermines some discussions, simply because people get too aggressive/defensive.
6) Journaling sites
7) Journaling sites stimulate creativity a lot more, you have more motivation to creat content yourself, fanboards allow for interaction with the authors on occasion and also they give you a look at what people you'd not friend on LJ are up to, for better or for worse. Sometimes on the boards the aggreiveness gives me the heevies.
8)Pretty much answered that one above. Yes, there is a difference. I think people who are more drawn towards interacting with the story, by creating fanart are mostly on the journaling sites. The fanboards are more to exchange opinions about current events in fandom, with a wider crowd than one would pick on LJ.
9) A lot less enthusiastic than on LJ, while here I get the impression that slash is pretty much something everyone does. In the boards everything revolved around the canon pairings and slasher are seen as a fringe group.
10) I don't know if i had gotten into fandom via the forums, because they don't do much in the way of celebrating wha I loved about the show. On there it's too often about defending your view to others.
While on the journaling sites, you can just enjoy the art, fic, meta until you're ready to create some yourself.
11) LJ

[tkp.livejournal.com]

What BtVS forum? As fen, I'm curious.

On journaling sites you can go into more intricate complex discussions about controversial points in the show,

True! Which is interesting, because when I first got an lj I thought I would not be able to get into as many complex discussions. Everything on a journaling site has to do with time. If you don't make your sally at the correct moment, no one will ever see it--or, if someone sees it, other people won't know it's there to join in. I thought that this would make for some very narrow discussions, but there are enough people here that once in a while someone sees you and they are AWESOME and you are AWESOME and you just have this AWESOME discussion.

But it is easy to get caught in just your preferred corner of fandom

This is interesting. I found myself more caught up in a corner on forums. I can figure out whether this was due to the difference in fandoms or the difference in mediums. The thing is, while you're more likely to see a broader range on a forum, I tend not to pay attention to it. I just think, "those people over there are talking about something I have no interest in". But on lj, if I happen to have someone friended who is talking about something I'm not interested in, it's forced upon me. And I'm more likely to read it because it's someone I know (whereas if someone I know on a forum is saying something I'm not interested in, I might not even see it). As such I've become more interested in more diverse things on lj.

I think people who are more drawn towards interacting with the story, by creating fanart are mostly on the journaling sites. The fanboards are more to exchange opinions about current events in fandom, with a wider crowd than one would pick on LJ.

This is interesting! Especially because I feel like the journaling format is so bad for fan works. I feel like on a forum your work is more visible--even if it's buried under billions of threads or other stories, more people will see it, you know?

In the boards everything revolved around the canon pairings and slasher are seen as a fringe group.

That's my experience! I can't figure out why this is so.

Thanks for answering these!

[stefanie-bean.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it?
LOST
2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
www.thefuselage.com
3) When was this?
This morning!
4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Yes
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
Because I wanted to hear other peoples' opinions about Tuesday's (most recent) LOST episode.
6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
My LOST activity is mostly done on The Fuselage.
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
Since most of my f-list is interested in Phantom of the Opera, I don't inflict my LOST obsession on them, through LJ :D
8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
The Fuse has a pretty large body of people who kind of wander through to leave comments; as well as a smaller, more "hard-core" group. Also, I like the way The Fuse is organized. You can either discuss individual episodes, or go to another section specifically for meta (theories, speculation, philosophy, etc.)
9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
I really haven't found much discussion of LOST slash in that forum. Lots of het 'shipping, though.
10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
Getting involved with The Fuse was quite easy - I just jumped in and started discussing stuff.
11) Which medium do you prefer? For discussing LOST, I prefer forums. But I spent a lot of time on www.phantomoftheopera.com, too (another forum), until I realized I was repeating myself on a lot of points. With LOST, since it's a story still-in-progress, there's new stuff to talk about each week.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Oh, that's interesting. I wonder if many people switch between mediums for closed canon and open canon, like you do? It's weird to me though that the forum works better for the open canon. My problem with LJ when I first got here was the time factor--you post something and pretty much three days later, it's probably ancient history, unless you got recced around. Even if you get really interested in someone you're unlikely to read their whole journal--just the last couple posts. So it seems to me a journaling site would work so much better for the changing-every-week stuff.

Maybe the reason the forum is better for that is just the nature of the people who use it--as you say, people just passing on through. And I guess the reason for the difference in the users is that if you get an lj you're sort of making an investment; you're saying, "I am here for the long haul". Well, maybe getting an lj isn't saying that, but talking about a new fandom, finding new friends for it, getting involved in comms and such--that's an investment. Do you think once LOST is over that you'll still be into it?

Non-Journaling Fandom Survey

[vaysh11.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it?
LotR
2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
Forum and Mailing Lists
3) When was this?
2003 to 2006
4) Are you still active in that fandom?
No
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
Journaling sites were not used. The mailing list and posting stories to archives and personal websites was how fandom worked.
6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
Much more active in fandom on journaling site.
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
Much more interaction between writers, readers, commenters. Much more discussion. Much more RL information easily shared. I learned more about coding. I wrote more fic. There were no fic fests organised in the archives or mailing lists (and to my knowledge, there still aren't)
8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
In my experience, the differences have not much to do with the different fen of LotR and HP. Both fandoms went into journaling sites, it's just that I am active in HP now.
9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
The mailing lists I was active on were all slash lists. Some of the big archives had issues with slash, but in general it was more the other readers, not the mods.
10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
Harder.
11) Which medium do you prefer?
Journaling site, for sure.

Interesting stuff! :)

Re: Non-Journaling Fandom Survey

[tkp.livejournal.com]

There were no fic fests organised in the archives or mailing lists (and to my knowledge, there still aren't)

This is my experience too. Why do you think this is? Is it because anyone can organize a fest on LJ, whereas in a forum or mailing list people feel like they have to be a mod or something?

Thanks for answering these questions. My experience at non-journaling fandom spaces has been so different, and I just don't understand why!

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

Do College Basketball discussion boards count? There's pretty much no Yaoi there.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

They count sort of. I just watched this movie called "Big Fan". It was interesting from a fandom perspective--there were some things that were so fannish (in my sense of the word), and other things that seemed so alien. I think the film worked well as a snapshot, but bad as a film--it seemed very static.

Anyway, this is how it counts: do you think college basketball fans would ever use journaling sites to discuss college basketball? Why or why not? What about the format isn't suited to discussion of college basketball?

[rahirah]

When I first got into online BtVS fandom, I started out in the Usenet newsgroups. From there I joined several mailing lists and forums, and eventaully LJ. I still check the Cold Dead Seed forum for updates on the Buffyverse actors, and I use the episode guides, transcripts, and screencaps on other sites for fic research and occasional iconning or manipping.

In my previous fandom, back in the age of the dinosaurs, I participated in local fan clubs, and in by-mail fan clubs, most of which involved making fanzines (at various times I wrote, illustrated, edited, and did layout and printing for half a dozen different zines.) One of the clubs I belonged to had several email mailing lists, and I eventually created a website for it.

I think it's easier to get into fandom via non-journaling sites, because you know that everyone there is there for the same reason you are. On journaling sites, it's a lot harder to connect with other fans unless you know someone who's already there.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

you know that everyone there is there for the same reason you are.

Yes, and that makes it easy to step into conversations. It's interesting though--for obviously the same reasons, it's harder to talk about stuff not fandom related to that particular fandom on non-journal sites. The worst is the stuff you want to talk about that tangentially related to that fandom, but not quite. It makes topical relationships very easy on forums, but deeper relationships more difficult (for me). I guess that's why I never felt like I was a "part" of something in forums/mailing lists. It's odd, because lj is so much more dispersed, but I do feel a part of something here.

Though with mail fan clubs and local fan clubs, I think you're a part of something by default.

[grey-hunter.livejournal.com]

I used to belong to mailing lists and a forum, both in the HP fandom, but I stopped participating when I discovered LJ because the format suited me more. Besides, my most common "activity" in any fandom is to read fics. The mailing lists were author-owned, or specific fanfic oriented, so there wasn't much of a difference between those and LJ. The forums were more general and RPG centered, and I'm not really into RPG. I did join another forum later, in the CSI fandom, planned to check it out regularly, but then I just couldn't be bothered and I'm no longer in that fandom, so it's doubtful I'll ever go back. At both of those forums, some members were slashers and the rest was fairly tolerant to both slash and fanfiction writing, so I didn't have a bad experience in that regard.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

I find it interesting that journaling sites seem to be the go-to for fanfic. It seems to me forums are a better place to host fics.

I also think forum RPG is interesting. The first RPG I ever joined was on a forum, and it seemed ridiculous--I have since participated in an RPG on a journaling site and it made more sense to me. But I'm not a huge RPGer so I don't have a lot of experience.

Thanks!

[doro-chan.livejournal.com]

1) Varied? It's a multi-fandom archive.
2) Multi-fandom archive with added forums.
3) Since you refer to discussion: yesterday.
4) see 3)
5) Because the fandom in question doesn't really use journaling sites (much).
6) Lately: other places. It varies.
7) Well, less complicated meta discussion that builds on years of discussion before that. I'm also a mod there, so my role is a different one most of the time.
8) Different language (German). Mostly younger fen than on journaling sites. Less meta, different meta. Explaining the why would take a long meta post.
9) Varied. There are slash fen and slash haters, since it's a huge multi-fandom archive.
10) No. I actually found it far more difficult to get into a fandom through journals, which are too decentralized. I also participated there first.
11) Both have their advantages and disadvantages. I prefer a mix.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Well, less complicated meta discussion that builds on years of discussion before that.

Do you mean this is true for non-journaling sites? It's interesting, because it seems to me on a forum, it would be easier to build on years of discussion--all of that discussion is there and fairly easy to read. On a journaling site to read older discussions you have to go to a whole bunch of individual journals, which can be really hard to do.

But on a journaling site, it's my experience that it's in the end easier to build deeper and more lasting relationships, so then it would be easier to have discussions that are the result of years--but only with people you know.

Explaining the why would take a long meta post.

If you ever do that meta post, I would be really interested in it!

[hlbr.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it? Jane Austen
2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc) Forum, and mailing list
3) When was this? Yesterday? Something like that.
4) Are you still active in that fandom? Yes.
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site? Because it's not at a journaling site. (Apart from that, I tend to prefer community participation in places less splintered than journaling sites, but it's not like when the fandom is here I have much choice. I just use what the particular fandom uses.)
6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places? Eh, no idea. I post fic currently only at the AO3. I post blog type thing to my dw and lj. I discuss stuff where discussion arises. Meta tends to be in dw/lj. Fic discussion is at both places. I really only write in the JA fandom, and that takes a big chunk of my interaction, I guess, but I read in many other fandoms and discuss fannish stuff in many fandoms, aside for having an interest in meta.
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation? It's more isolated in journaling sites, it seems to me--and there's more connection with you as a person not a fan, as your lj/dw is directly connected with whatever you say.
8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place? There are differences, but I've participated in those types of places in other fandoms (particularly, HP), and the differences were others, so I think that the only thing the types of places determine is that different mediums crosspolinate very little.
9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?) From indifference to distaste. Some interest, it has been my impression that mainly from people who're already multifannish. (But JA fandom is a very heterocentric fandom--HP had forums where slash was the genre and forums where it was not--for different reasons. I actually have a theory of why, but I think it exceeds this poll.)
10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site? Er, about the same? Both have the thing about not knowing anyone and thinking everyone knows each other already, and I have no frieeends, who would care about what I think stuff. It was easier for me lj/dw, but that's because when I got into it I already had friends from forums and archives.
11) Which medium do you prefer? Mhh. Depending for what. For blogging? A journaling site (dw). For posting stories? Archives (A03). For community interaction? Some sort of forum, though I haven't found software that really works for me yet.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Oh! Do you mind my asking what forum? I started in fandom at Republic of Pemberley.

I think that the only thing the types of places determine is that different mediums crosspolinate very little.

I wonder why!

From indifference to distaste. Some interest, it has been my impression that mainly from people who're already multifannish. (But JA fandom is a very heterocentric fandom--HP had forums where slash was the genre and forums where it was not--for different reasons. I actually have a theory of why, but I think it exceeds this poll.)

If you ever post about your theory of why, or wish to discuss, I am very interested! The reason I did this post is that I started in Jane Austen, on a forum, and it was heterocentric. I participated in several other small, heterocentric fandoms through forums and mailing lists. I felt very comfortable and welcomed in all of them. During this time, I tried to get into both HP and X-men (huge, nonheterocentric fandoms) on forums and mailing lists, and felt like I couldn't connect to anyone.

Then I got very into BtVS (another huge nonheterocentric fandom), got an lj, and had a completely different fannish experience than any I had had before. I've been playing here a long time, and have found plenty of ways to feed my HP and Star Trek needs ... but not so much for my fannish interest in literature and period dramas.

Just now I'm extremely taken with North and South (Elizabeth Gaskell's novel and the BBC adaptation), and not seeing any real fandom for it here, I went afield. There's a forum which is very active in discussion of N&S, but it's really driven home to me how different this fen is than that of journaling sites.

What I really want to know is why aren't literature and period drama fandoms big on journaling sites? Is there something about the sort of person who is interested in such a fandom, something that also gravitates towards non-journaling mediums? And does that something also generally gravitate towards het? Or is it just that lit and period drama fandoms lend themselves to het so much more easily?

...Sorry to babble on.

For posting stories? Archives (A03)

How do you feel about the feedback you get at A03? The main reason I post stories on lj is I feel like people comment if I hold stuff up for them to see.

Thanks so much for your thoughts!

[st-crispins.livejournal.com]

In MFU fandom, we still have several active mailing lists on Yahoogroups. The main one, Channel D [which has been going nonstop since 1996] is currently buzzing like a hive over a possible new feature film.

We also have print zines, some due out this May at MediaWest. We also have panels at MediaWest and get together informally for dinner and parties.

There are several other mini-cons in which groups meet, particularly one in the UK every spring.

And yes, we also have several LJ communities.

I, like others, participate in all of them.

[myxginxblossoms.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it? The Cal Leandros series by Rob Thurman.
2) What was the medium? Most of the active internets fandom can be found on the Tumulus messageboard (http://robthurmanbooks.proboards92.com/index.cgi); there are comms, but they're rarely in use.
3) When was this? Up until this spring, I was reasonably interested/active in the fandom. People still use that forum, but it's not a large fandom.
4) Are you still active in that fandom? No. The book series continues, but my patience with the author does not.
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site? As mentioned above, that's where the fandom's centered. Thurman herself used to post there, too.
6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places? I'm more active on journaling sites overall.
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation? It felt less immediate than it might on eljay; people on not-journaling sites aren't on them nearly as often.
8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place? The fans tended to be/come off as much younger than in many of my fandoms, so most differences can be chalked up to that and the feeling of "what if the author is watching." Saying anything critical of the series wasn't especially welcome, for instance.
9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? Shallow fangirling. Not that there's anything wrong with that--it's a series for that sort of thing--but the attitude was basically, "they're pretty, sounds good."
10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site? About the same? I don't feel a very strong connection to fandom outside of people I already know anyway, for a lot of reasons. If I was aiming for a closer bond with other fandom people, I would find it a lot less gratifying in the short term, though.
11) Which medium do you prefer? Journal sites, because that's where my friends are.

I've had other fandoms where the fandom presence is stronger/extant at all outside journal sites, but in at least one case (A Song of Ice and Fire, I'm looking at you), I've heard enough about how disagreeable the general viewpoints of non-journal fandom are that I have little desire to go seeking it.

Also, my experiences with fandom tend to be less social in general than I think others' are. I already have my small group of friends to get excited over things with; I don't necessarily want to go try and bond with strangers.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Oh, so it seems like in this case the reason fen set up camp where they did had to do with the author. That makes sense--what I can figure out is when where a fandom is situated seems arbitrary. Is it really just chance? or something about the nature of the fen, or fandom?

Saying anything critical of the series wasn't especially welcome, for instance.

Sounds like a bummer.

I've heard enough about how disagreeable the general viewpoints of non-journal fandom are that I have little desire to go seeking it.

Yeah, this is what's strange to me. Is it a different kind of fan that goes to non-journaling sites?

Oh, Song of Ice and Fire. I read the first two, and got a little fed up (with Sansa. Why do I have to read about Sansa?), but now for some reason everyone at my work is reading it. My work is awesome. It makes me want to try again.

[overlord-mordax.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it?
Silent Hill
2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
Forum
3) When was this?
Today
4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Yes
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
More active base; multiple concurrent discussions
6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
Journalism
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
Discussions bleeding over through multiple topics
8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
Yeah, there's a difference. Its just the nature of the medium. Journaling is focused on one post at a time, whereas a board is less linear.
9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
Eh, probably hostile? Never came up.
10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
Easier.
11) Which medium do you prefer?
Either. Journaling has an advantage because I can check them all at ocne through my friends list though.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Cool, thanks for your answers.

Journaling is focused on one post at a time, whereas a board is less linear.

This is what I've always liked about boards.

[deathmask-revel.livejournal.com]

J! I have a question for YOU, not concerning this list--which is interesting but which I am not answering because I am not involved enough with fandom as a whole to feel my answered would be...valid, I suppose.

Okay, my question is this:

I want to get some really good, interesting, revealing discussion going in the fandom that I AM currently involved in, but I'm not sure what kinds of questions to ask. What kinds of things have you seen in the past that have seemed to get good responses from thinky people? Things like why people are interested in a certain fandom, or a certain theme within a certain storyline--that kind of thing.

Thanks in advance!

~E

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Hmmmm. Sorry to get to this so late--I didn't read the replies until today.

I used to write lists of questions, but that doesn't really get things going most of the time. People answer like it's a survey--which is great if you want answers, but not if you want to get people generally talking.

You know, now that you've made me sit down and think about this, I feel like there are three big things that REALLY get people going:

1) Wank. This is sort of non-viable, since I don't think you or I really want to be wanky ourselves (though I like to watch). One thing you could do though is post about an issue that is controversial in the fandom, or take a stance on it. If there aren't many wank issues in the fandom, you can almost always find one--even if you don't have a stance on it one way or another, you can state a case, then say, "I don't really believe this, but what do you think?"
2) The right question at the right time. It's usually not a general question, like, "hey, what's up with this theme?" It's more like, "Why *is* Spike a bitch? Discuss!" or something. The thing is, I've totally tried that and it just didn't manage to catch anyone's eye. You've got to have luck, or else some kind of charm in phrasing the question.
3) Meaty meta, and this is my default. I pick out something interesting, come up with several points about it, which leads to several conclusions. After my points and conclusions I try to have mini-lists of questions, like, "what do you think? do you agree? IS Spike a bitch? Am I crazy?" etc. Writing good meaty meta can take a lot of time, and there's always the risk people won't read it. But if you're thoughtful about it, usually you make other people thinky too, and they appreciate what you've said, and want to say something about it themselves.

That said--I've never mastered the art of making people talk to me. I'm pretty heavy-handed on lj, in that I ask lots and lots and lots of questions in order to try to get people to answer. It doesn't always provoke the most scintillating conversation--sometimes just lists of answers. But even those can turn into something interesting, if you comment back with thinky thoughts. It's what I'm doing on this post right here!

[starry-diadem.livejournal.com]

Here through metafandom

Yahoo groups is alive and surprisingly well. I last used it ten minutes ago, in the Lancer fandom which is thriving there and struggling very hard here on LJ.

(1) Lancer (1968 western)
(2) Yahell
(3) Daily
(4) Yes
(5) It's well established on Yahoo lists and has never migrated to a journalling site. When I created lancerlovers and mentioned it on list, virtually no-one there had heard of LJ and very few use it.
(6) That's fandom dependent. My other two fandoms - SGA and original series BSG migrated here to LJ years ago.
(7) Yahoo groups is clumsy and unsophisticated compared to a journalling site. You can't code, you can't use pictures in a post, it's harder to keep conversation threads together but the actual things I do - post fic, comment on other people's fic, discussions - remains the same. I think it's harder on Yahoo to keep track of a discussion, though, and the fen tend to be fairly determined and focused individuals as a result. Some of them scarily so. There is less 'personal' posting - my journal's a mix of fic and stuff about me, but that doesn't work on Yahoo.
(8) A little more traditionalist, maybe.
(9) Depends on the yahoo list. I'm a member of 14 different Lancer Yahoo groups, only one of which is slash oriented. The fandom's two characters are brothers, but unlike with Supernatural, there's no incest genre. So to talk about slash there will result in some distaste!
(10) I don't think there was a real difference. It still depends on you(generic you) posting and responding and getting to be known.
(11) Journalling site. I prefer to post properly coded fics with headers and I much prefer keeping all the comments with the post.

[blktauna.insanejournal.com (from livejournal.com)]

Lancer?!?! Lancer!!!!! OMG Johnny!!!!!

Here from metafandom

[blueinkedpalm.livejournal.com]

Interesting question! Fannish spaces are so much more than LJ/DW.

1) What fandom was it? There are two main ones for me outside LJ/DW--Ace Lightning, Baldur's Gate.

2) What was the medium? Both are forums.

3) When was this? Both forums have existed since ~2004 and ~2002 respectively.

4) Are you still active in that fandom? Yes.

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site? For the first fandom, I know that the fans who set it up didn't know about Livejournal, or didn't feel it suited their needs. For the second fandom, I found the forum there an interesting place more active than Livejournal.

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places? Probably at other places; I like posting fic on the Pit of Voles/forums.

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation? A lot of Livejournal fandom seems to me to be media-based--live action television shows with large slash fandoms. Maybe that's just because I subscribe to metafandom, but the fandoms that have been my favourite so far have happened to end up with infrastructure outside Livejournal.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place? I think forums can become more insular than journaling sites. They're a single, centralized location, with a requirement to register to sign up; I think the culture on a forum tends to grow more homogeneous than fandom on journaling sites, because the latter is spread across communities and personal journals. Journal communities also tend to gain their own cultures and ways, though.

9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?) There were slash fans in the Ace Lightning forum from its early days, and I don't remember anyone complaining about yaoi. When I look back through the Baldur's Gate forum's older archives, though, I've come across fairly intense debates involving the classic outmoded lines like 'you make them gay!' or 'so-and-so's-one-girlfriend-makes-him-canonically-straight!'.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site? In a journaling site, it's simple to post a personal entry on one's love for a fandom or post a fanfic, but if you want to engage further in the fandom you still have to go through the process of joining a community. Likewise, in a forum you typically have to register to start participating. I think the step of introducing oneself to a forum by posting an introduction/first fanfic is harder than posting some fannish love in one's own LJ, but a first post to a LJ community can similarly be difficult (depending on the community in question and one's general feelings about jumping into a new fandom and meeting new people).

11) Which medium do you prefer? I hate the way both forums and journaling sites manage archiving. I love reading fanfic, and I love being able to find fanfic, and in both cases it's more poorly organized than fanfic archives like the Pit of Voles and AO3. A forum poster of a serial story doesn't link to the previous versions; a journaling poster forgets to tag one chapter--searching forums is easier than searching journals, but in both it can be inconvenient. It torments me when I think I've missed out on something, and I like to read fic in places I can be sure of finding all the fic there is to find.

Re: Here from metafandom

[tkp.livejournal.com]

For the second fandom, I found the forum there an interesting place more active than Livejournal.

This is interesting to me. I understand that many fandoms existed before journaling sites and just did not make the transition. What I'm wondering about is why some newer fandoms choose non-journaling sites (or why newer fandoms choose journaling sites--either one! ...Although on a journaling site, you could potentially just say, "hey! I saw this new show or just read this book!" and then off you go, with several other people who are doing the same thing, or who have already done it but were interested too. That is, the fandom start up cost is a lot lower on a journaling site--and seems more intuitive?)

A lot of Livejournal fandom seems to me to be media-based--live action television shows with large slash fandoms.

I think this is true, and it's why I'm so interested. Why is this so? Right now I'm interested in a fandom based around a book written in the 1850s, and there's virtually no activity on LJ, and quite a lot on a forum I found. There's also no interest in slash on this forum. I started with the Jane Austen fandom--a fandom which also never really transitioned its home bases to journal sites, and which also has very little interest in slash. I'm trying to figure out why these different sorts of fandoms spring up in these different places.

(I guess it could have something to do with what I said about fandom arising intuitively on a journal site. If a show is airing, or HP books are coming out, many people at once might mention them in passing on their journals--and then suddenly there is a fandom. If I read a book by Elizabeth Gaskell--no one on LJ cares, and I have to be more active in my seeking of fandom.)

I hate the way both forums and journaling sites manage archiving. I love reading fanfic, and I love being able to find fanfic, and in both cases it's more poorly organized than fanfic archives like the Pit of Voles and AO3.

Oh man, SO TRUE.

A forum poster of a serial story doesn't link to the previous versions; a journaling poster forgets to tag one chapter

I really don't understand forum posters who don't link, and journal posters who don't tag. Of course, I understand forgetting to tag, but I've found stories that aren't tagged at all, and I wonder . . . why are these stories here? Aren't they meant to be read? And now they are unreadable! I, as a reader, don't necessarily feel entitled, but it makes me think the author is thoughtless (which isn't necessarily true!)

It torments me when I think I've missed out on something, and I like to read fic in places I can be sure of finding all the fic there is to find.

Eeeeee! You and me both.

Thanks for your answers!

Seen on metafandom

[countess-baltar.livejournal.com]

1) Battlestar Galactica (1978)

2) Usenet, mailing list, forums (also pre-internet paper fanzines and conventions).

3) Last used? E-mail list and forums were used, um, yesterday.

4) Other than temporary real life distractions, yes.

5) Because when the e-mail lists started, there were no journaling sites.

6) I'm more active at the other places.

7) Other than the particular show, that portion of the fandom has a common bond of having to deal with the self-proclaimed "superiority" of Ron Moore & followers. One e-mail list just pretends Ron and his "re-imagined" show don't exist.

8) Yes. The journaling sites circa 2006 to 2010 seemed to be loaded with "aca-fans".

9) One e-mail list is geared towards PG-13 "genfic" and the characters' canon "heteronomativity". In other words, no slash.

10) I thought so. See next answer.

11) The fans on my chosen e-mail lists and forums are closer to my worldview and I haven't found a similar "fit" on any journaling site.

Re: Seen on metafandom

[tkp.livejournal.com]

This is so interesting! In this case, having a different physical (er...nonphysical) space helps keep this fandom differentiated from another one.

Thanks for the insight!

[alias_sqbr]

Huh. I would have said I did most of my discussion on lj etc, yet I have participated in several different non-lj-clone fandomy things recently

1) What fandom was it?
Dragon Age Origins and Jane Austen

2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
IRC
A forum
3) When was this?
Today
Last month or so

4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Yes
5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
IRC is a totally different experience to journalling, since it's realtime

The forum is where the interesting conversation is happening (Jane Austen fandom isn't very big on lj etc)

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
Mostly on lj clones

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
I don't like forums at all, they're very off putting. IRC isn't very deep. So in general I need the lj clones for extended indepth conversation.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?

In the case of Dragon Age: No. It's much the same people. The forums seem to be different, more male for a start, but I avoid them.

Jane Austen fandom on lj seems to skew much younger and less meta-y.

I think being an older fandom whose canon appeals to an older audience has a lot to do with how different JA fandom is to DAO fandom including the difference in medium.

I am too sleepy for deeper analysis right now :)

9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)

Dragon Age: It's canon and everyone seems to embrace it wholeheartedly everywhere :D

Jane Austen: tepid at best, for the most part. That said people have been quite supportive of me writing femslash.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?

I'm mostly lj based, so a bit harder. I think the fact that Jane Austen fandom has no major lj presence does put me off a bit.

11) Which medium do you prefer?

LJ clones, though IRC is as I said it's own special thing and makes a nice addition.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Hey, another JA fan! This is so interesting, because I started in fandom as a JA fan, at Republic of Pemberley. What forum do you use?

The reason I actually did this post is that I'm really into Elizabeth Gaskell's North and South right now (and the BBC adaptation), and I just can't figure out why this fandom seems to mostly live on a forum. I understand the fandoms that were around before LJ was big, but the N&S adaptation came out in 2006, and it's what really made the N&S fandom exist. By that time, LJ fandom was fully alive and kickin'! ...Although now that I think about it, many on the N&S board say they're converted P&P fans. Maybe they were comfortable with the forum format and just stuck to it.

Jane Austen fandom on lj seems to skew much younger and less meta-y.

I think being an older fandom whose canon appeals to an older audience has a lot to do with how different JA fandom is to DAO fandom including the difference in medium.

This is really interesting, and something I haven't thought of before. I guess because when I think of JA, or N&S, I think: it's literature! Of course the people into it are going to be older and more intellectual. For my former main fandom on LJ, Buffy the Vampire Slayer, I just naturally think: it's called Buffy. It's going to be teens and they're going to talk about T, A, and general ass-kicking. But instead it's sort of flipped--I found very meta-oriented groups talking about BtVS, and JA--not so much. Then again, I shouldn't talk. I was 17 when I got involved in JA, and pretty much what I wanted to talk about all. the. time was Marianne and Brandon getting together. Though I did have a lot of meta, too.

That said people have been quite supportive of me writing femslash.

ooooh whom? (Please say Lizzy/Georgiana...I want me some of that.)

I think the fact that Jane Austen fandom has no major lj presence does put me off a bit.

I agree! Why isn't it here? I want it to be here! I tried to do this whole fic fest thing to liven up the 19th c. lit fic scene and it was a COLOSSAL FLOP. I thought if I built it they would come, you know? But very few came!

[vamp-ress.livejournal.com]

Adding my two cents, because for me LJ is just a means to an end and in no way the perfect way to do fandom. So, whenever I can be away from LJ (or any journaling service), I am away from it.

1) What fandom was it?
Lord of the Rings, Blood Ties

2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
mailing lists, forum, multifandom archive, singlefandom archive

3) When was this?
Five minutes ago:)

4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Yupp.

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
Because I'm in fandom mostly for the fic and for a number of reasons I think LJ is a bad place for fic.

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
Difficult to say, it's probably 50/50, mostly because one of my main fandoms (LotRPS) is mostly happening on LJ.

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
I think journaling sites let you see a more complete picture of a person (you just have to decide whether you actually want that), because most people use LJ as their personal space - posting meta, personal stuff, pics, fic, different fandoms. Whereas on mailing lists and fic archives the interaction centers around the fandom in question. You're more on topic.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
I don't think there's much of a difference - yes, of course, the way people will interact depends on the platform they use and certain traditions and conventions will evolve. But I don't think it goes deeper than this. Rather, I think fandoms as a whole are different from one another. One will have more fic, one will attract vidders, one will be very traditional and so on.

9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
In LOTR at least, the general consensus doesn't depend on the platform. It's either love or hate and you'll always find people who will flame those with a differing opinion.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
I generally don't start out in a fandom on LJ, because I never know where to start. I prefer to find a fanfic archive and work my way through from there.

11) Which medium do you prefer?
Depends on what I want to do at the moment. If I want to read fic: an archive. If I want to discuss aspects of a fandom: list, forum, LJ. If I just want to talk with likeminded people: LJ.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

I think LJ is a bad place for fic.

I agree completely. Several people have answered, "I'm at LJ because it seems like that's where the fic is." And for me, that seems to be true--I find so much more of the fanfic I want to read here than anywhere else. But it also seems to be the absolute WORST place for the posting and consumption of fic; I do not understand it!

Rather, I think fandoms as a whole are different from one another.

...Yes, I think that this is so. But I also think traditions and conventions evolve within particular fandoms which make them seem more different than the fen actually are. For instance, if one fandom has more vidders and another more fic, it might not be the case that vidders were interested in one and fanfic writers in the other, or even that the canon lends itself more to one or another. It can be just that someone did a very good vid in one fandom, which led to "generations" of people following that lead, making the fandom vid-centric, you know?

Thanks so much for your answers--this is really interesting.

[dolorosa-12.livejournal.com]

Here via metafandom

1) What fandom was it?
Two fandoms, His Dark Materials (books, not the movie) and Obernewtyn, an Australian fantasy series.

2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
Forums.

3) When was this?
For HDM, since 2003, for Obernewtyn, since 2008.

4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Extremely.

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
I joined the HDM forum after googling 'His Dark Materials+fansite', and it was the first thing that came up. At that point I hadn't heard of any of the main journalling sites (or, indeed, of blogging at all). I joined the Obernewtyn forum on the recommendation of a real-life friend.

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
I'm much more active in fandom on the other places; I'm a passive participant in fandom on journalling sites (commenting on people's fanfic occasionally, using icons that people have made).

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
Incredibly. I'm in fandom for discussion and commentary. I don't write fanfic or read it much, I can't make icons, and it seems to me that journal-based fandoms are much more interested in producing fanworks rather than providing an outlet for discussion. I don't know if it's related to the medium, or just the types of people who tend to use the different media.

With both my forums, I'm well-known to the other users, and have met a substantial number of them in real life. I chat to them in IRC conversations almost every day, have added them on Facebook and read their blogs. I've established friendships that go beyond their fannish origins.

On Livejournal, I'm not known at all. I don't interact with other fans beyond occasional comments to their posts and replies to such comments.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
I think the difference is more in the kind of activity taking place in each respective medium, rather than the media themselves. Journalling fandom, for better or worse (at least in the kinds of communities of which I am a member), seems to encourage a hierarchical form of interaction, with producers of fanworks (writers, fanartists, vidders and so on) privileged over consumers of such works. I'm not saying that such people are being deliberately exclusive (since if I really wanted to I could learn how to make graphics or try to write fanfic and so on), but that the type of fannish interaction taking place encourages that type of exclusivity. When fannish activity is centred on discussion, everyone is on much more of an equal footing.

Of course, the nature of the media exacerbate this contrast in hierarchical/non-hierarchical fandom: journalling sites have a post (privileged)-comments (not-so-privileged) structure, whereas forums have threads where all responses are equal.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

I don't write fanfic or read it much, I can't make icons, and it seems to me that journal-based fandoms are much more interested in producing fanworks rather than providing an outlet for discussion.

Oh! This is really interesting! Several people have said LJ is more fanworks-centric. I think that this is true, though I can't understand why. I feel like forums would be so much better to host a multi-chaptered fanfic, you know?

When I first got on LJ, I was very discussion oriented. Between discussion and fanfic, I have to say I was far more interested in fanfic, but I've always been a very metatative person. I write a lot of meta and like to get into big long discussions about canon and interpretation, and I did not think LJ suited to that. In fact, I still don't think LJ is suited to that--for similar reasons to not thinking it's suited to posting fanfic.

And yet, I've managed to get into more involved discussions on journaling sites than I can ever find going on in forums. Maybe I'm going to the wrong forums? I think the main thing is that on LJ things tend to blossom into much larger topics (for good or ill). I might make a post about Lyra, see, and say something about gender, and then someone gloms onto that and is talking about gender politics in HDM, and then someone gloms onto that and is talking about gender politics in general media, etc. On a forum, people totally go OT all the time, but it tends to be more narrow in my experience.

It's interesting too, what you say about knowing people personally on the forums, vs. not knowing people on LJ. I've found it far easier to build personal relationships on LJ; I wonder if this is at all related to our differing experiences regarding the ability to have deep, complex discussions?

seems to encourage a hierarchical form of interaction

This is really interesting! I know that hierarchy exists, and since there's a lot more fanfic on journaling sites, it makes sense that that hierarchy would be here and not elsewhere. Still, I've seen people who are "privileged" as producers of meta--which isn't quite the same as discussion, I supposed, since meta can be produced independently. But meta is also seen as a facilitation of discussion. Huh. Thanks for this food for thought--I never thought about it in quite this way.

journalling sites have a post (privileged)-comments (not-so-privileged) structure, whereas forums have threads where all responses are equal.

Oh, yeah--again, as both you and I are saying, LJ is really just difficult for conversation. I still fail to see why I've had so much better discussion experiences here. I have to think about it more!

Thanks again.

My comment was too long...

[dolorosa-12.livejournal.com]

9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
If there was any slash-writing going on, it was taking place away from the forums. The His Dark Materials forum doesn't have a fanfic section (although some members write fic, mainly longish, adventure-type gen) and the Obernewtyn forum seems to focus much more on 'missing moments' genfic as well.

I can't remember any discussion of slash, whether in relation to fanfic or just in relation to interpretations of the books, ever coming up. Discussion was very much focused on canon, and we did discuss canonically gay pairings (the angels Balthamos and Baruch in HDM, for instance), but not in relation to pairings in and of themselves. Shipping, as a whole, was not discussed on the forums in any extensive way.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
I think I discussed this at 6 and 7, but I'll reiterate - I found it much easier to get into fandom through my forums than through journalling sites. I think this is mainly due to my particular preferred forms of fannish interaction, rather than any particular fault of the fen who participate in fandom on journalling sites, though.

11) Which medium do you prefer?
I prefer the forums for the reasons outlined above, but I wish the situation wasn't like this. There are a lot of people in my LJ-based fandoms whom I'd love to get to know better, but I don't really know how to go about it or how to interact with them when I feel like I'm coming from such an unequal position (ie not producing fanworks that other fen can enjoy).

Re: My comment was too long...

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Discussion was very much focused on canon,

I wonder if this is because there was no focus on fanfic? I mean, that sounds obvious, but for me, discussion has always had a lot of elements of "what if?" This might be because I also write fic, but there are some canons I'm interested in for which I'm not interesting in writing fic; I mostly just want to discuss. But even for those canons I'll tend to get shippy, or tend to want to explore things which aren't explicitly in canon, but which canon suggests.

I don't really know how to go about it or how to interact with them when I feel like I'm coming from such an unequal position (ie not producing fanworks that other fen can enjoy)

:o( As a fic writer, I can't identify on the unequal position level, but I do feel like getting into a fandom on journaling sites is hard. As someone above put it, in a forum, you can be sure of why everyone's there, and you know there's at least one thing you share. On a journaling site you have to actually go out and find individuals and connect with them in order to get any discussion out of it. But it's for this reason, too, that I feel I've made deeper relationships on LJ. I have/had some good friends from forum days, but there's more connection with individuals on LJ for me.

I know you're not looking for advice or anything like that, but I do feel that people pay attention to meta--which, I mean, if you're interested in discussion, you probably have meta. Or even if you don't have meta, you probably have questions you're interested in asking, because you want to hear other people's opinions. You just have to make sure people see the questions--so you kind of have to pimp yourself to a newsletter and/or metafandom. I don't like doing that; I'm extremely grateful someone else apparently pimped this to metafandom! But it really works. Sometimes strangers show up and you just have these really long conversations.

Now, metafandom is huge, so you don't necessarily build relationships that way, but if you're posting a lot of discussion type things in one fandom generally people start to notice they're clicking over the the same person over and over. They also notice if you're the person they keep getting into long conversations with.

Lastly--if there's people you want to know better, I've found that being a little persistent does work. Obviously, you don't want to stalk anyone or comment on their every post. But ...if there's someone whose thinky thoughts you really like, if you continue to reply to posts they make that interest you with your own thinky thoughts, generally they will notice, "hey! This person has good discussion!" even if you're not posting fanworks.

Thanks so much for answering these questions--this is really interesting!

[penguineggs.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it?

Lord Peter wimsey (Dorothy L. Sayers)
2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)

Yahoogroups
3) When was this?

Within the last few weeks
4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Intermittently

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
I actually do both, but the core group is on the yahoogroup

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?

Journalling
7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?

My participation in mailing list fandoms has dried up.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?

Age and social class. Also political outlook. Mailing list and yahoogroup fandoms have been predominantly right of centre, socially conservative, well-off and middle-aged if not elderly. the reverse is true on journalling sites. If asked to speculate, I'd say the older group are happier with a more organised (moderated) list than the free-form of journaling sites.


9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)

Detestation combined with bafflement, coupled with an assumption that the small minority of people who raised topics such as homosexuality (even in cases where it was a topic clearly signalled in canon) were doing so specifically to annoy the rest of the group and were, in fact, acting immaturely and childishly.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
easier to get in; not to develop further.
11) Which medium do you prefer?
Journalling.

[tkp.livejournal.com]

Age and social class. Also political outlook. Mailing list and yahoogroup fandoms have been predominantly right of centre, socially conservative, well-off and middle-aged if not elderly. the reverse is true on journalling sites. If asked to speculate, I'd say the older group are happier with a more organised (moderated) list than the free-form of journaling sites.

Oh! This is fascinating. What a great insight. I was wondering if non-journaling sites seemed more conservative due to the fandoms that had a strong internet presence before journaling sites became popular. Maybe they just didn't want to move, and so the older people would be on non-journaling sites. But this didn't seem to make sense, as internet fandom's really only been huge for 15 years, and that's such a short amount of time--not enough to separate age groups between different styles of fandom participation, I think.

It makes more sense that certain ages/personality types gravitate towards the control/organization of non-journaling sites. But I am not conservative, and I *do* gravitate towards organization and control--not the fact that forums and mailing lists have mods, but the fact that you can browse according to topic, not person. I found LJ just a horrible medium for long discussions on which many people could join in with different opinions. Actually, I still find it that way--it's not a list of things to talk about, it's a list of people you have to get to know. And yet I find the people on LJ are more, er, my kinda people.

Detestation combined with bafflement, coupled with an assumption that the small minority of people who raised topics such as homosexuality (even in cases where it was a topic clearly signalled in canon) were doing so specifically to annoy the rest of the group and were, in fact, acting immaturely and childishly.

I'm trying to participate in a forum right now. No one has called me immature or childish for talking about slash (and gender politics, and queer theory), but I keep getting the distinct FEELING that that's what everyone feels whenever I have to pipe up and say, "hello gender dynamics!!!" I couldn't tell whether it was just me, whether it was the medium of fandom interaction, whether it was the fandom itself, whether it was the fen--or whether the nature of the fen had to do with the medium itself, or the fandom itself. Anyway, it's like a different world out there! Though it does seem like it depends on the fandom, as some people in response to this have been saying their mailing lists et al were open to slash.

Thanks so much for your answers.

[blktauna.insanejournal.com (from livejournal.com)]

Your questions

1) What fandom was it?
The Sweeney, The Professionals, MFU

2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
2 message boards and two mailing lists

3) When was this? within the last few days.

4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Absolutely

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
I rather dislike journaling sites for activities other than journaling. There's no means of seeing all the contributions, no means of keeping up with all the discussions and no proper form of archiving.

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
Depends on your version of "in fanom".

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
depends on your definition of "in fanom"

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
Yes there is a difference. The boards and mailing lists are as smothering, controlling, or as eager to make everyone conform to "nice"
It's hard to withold information and ignore people on mailing lists and forums. Of course you can make a kill file, but you don't cut the other person off unless you banhammer them.


9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
Well for the Sweeney... they are terrified of it. Total no go on their turf. I knew about that before hand so it wasn't anything I mentioned, but several others have and the reaction has been... a whole lot of protesting too much ;) The Professionals and the MFU areas are quite at ease with the reality of slash.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?

Far easier outside a journaling site.

11) Which medium do you prefer?
Actually I like mailing lists. Great archive, easy to access from any device, easy to keep up with, great archiving.

Forums are nice as well. I really am not a fan of LJ and I use it as little as possible. You can never find anything, if you do it's always locked down, there's no sort of central area for anything, no reasonable search method, no reasonable archiving of past discussions, if you could ever find them in the first place... I have never understood the allure of journals except as journals. They work poorly for anything else.

[blktauna.insanejournal.com (from livejournal.com)]

oops, typo

Yes there is a difference. The boards and mailing lists *aren't* as smothering, controlling, or as eager to make everyone conform to "nice"
It's hard to withold information and ignore people on mailing lists and forums. Of course you can make a kill file, but you don't cut the other person off unless you banhammer them.

Here from metafandom

[rizny.livejournal.com]

1) What fandom was it?
Superman/superheroes in general

2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)
A new forum

3) When was this?
Today

4) Are you still active in that fandom?
Yes, very - I make icons and manips.

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?
My friend started this new forum to replace an old one that closed, and I went to check it out. I didn't participate in the old one.

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?
About 99% active on LJ.

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?
It was weird - I'm not used to forums, and in this one the posting went so quickly I couldn't keep up and felt kind of lost. I probably will hardly be participating there at all.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?
Definitely there are differences. On journaling sites it's only as busy as you make it by adding to your friendslist, but on forums you have no choice about being able to keep up. Forums also seem to be less flexible in terms of what you can do - I mean, I guess they have a lot of similar features to LJ but for example you don't need icon makers with huge posts of icons, and everybody is there for the same reason, whereas on LJ you have access to lots of different "forums" in the way of communities and who you friend.

9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)
No idea, but there seemed to be more men, whereas most people on my flist are women. And in the forum they seemed more interested in just general snark and hanging around rather than thoughtful meta and graphics.

10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?
Definitely harder. If a new fandom was only on a forum, not on LJ, I wouldn't be able to get into it. My whole fandom life is on LJ.

11) Which medium do you prefer?
LJ - see above.

Re: Here from metafandom

[tkp.livejournal.com]

No idea, but there seemed to be more men, whereas most people on my flist are women.

I wonder why this is. Part of the reason I did this post is I wish I knew why people gravitate towards the fannish medium they do, and it's still no clearer . . .

And in the forum they seemed more interested in just general snark and hanging around rather than thoughtful meta and graphics.

I've noticed that in forums, too. It could be the forum or the fandom, I guess. Or it could be the lack of women. While some men do it, it's almost exclusively women who write fanfic, or create other works like graphics and vids.

Thanks for your answers--this is fascinating stuff!

By Metafandom

[kokibi.livejournal.com]

Not sure if it helps, but I thought...hey, why not add a completely different fandom experience. Nobody seems to have mentioned fandom via image board!


1) What fandom was it?

Three, actually.
1)Umineko no Naku Koro ni Fandom
2)general 'Yuri' Fandom (meaning F/F in anime/manga)
3)Touhou Fandom.

The three are not directly connected.

2) What was the medium? (e.g. was it a forum, a mailing list, etc)

1+2:Different forums
3)two work-safe imageboards for Touhou (one for general discussion, fanart, fanfic, and videos, the other for translation of japanese fan and official work).

3) When was this?

Today, in all three cases.

4) Are you still active in that fandom?

Yup, for all three.

5) Why did you participate there, and not at a journaling site?

I have yet to see something comparable on a journaling site. The topic of F/F is pretty much completely neglected on journaling sites, and Umineko on LJ isn't really focussing on the parts that interest me. Touhou is getting somewhat popular in RP circles on LJ, but that's it.

Also, on LJ, female characters are pretty much only considered when their lack is bemoaned, which usually mystifies me, since all my favorite canons have high numbers of important, strong (in terms of character, not necessarily physical power...although that happens too, in some cases) female characters, and such a view point seems to simply not exist in LJ-compatible fandoms that aren't, well, dead.

6) Are you more active in fandom on journaling sites or at other places?

Other places.

7) How did the different mode of interaction affect your fandom participation?

The modes do not matter to me, what matters is the content discussed. The medium did not affect my participation much at all.

8) Does there seem to you to be a difference in fen between the other medium and journaling sites? What are the differences? Why do you think those differences exist? Is it the nature of that fandom, or do you think it has anything to do with where that fandom is taking place?

LJ fandom seems to be more occupied with slash, and seems to dislike female characters a lot more. Other mediums like female characters a lot more. In fact, two of the three fandoms mentioned above are all about female characters.

Why? I don't know, I think it's because LJ-fandom is largely equal to the so-called 'Media Fandom', which seems to be for US-American series, which are largely male dominated and barely have stories passing the Bechdel test. It's probably natural to mostly find male characters in these series interesting, as female ones are written as accessoires for male ones for the most part. I just avoid canons like that, and thus can't really connect with media fandom much.

Re: By Metafandom

[kokibi.livejournal.com]

9) What were the fen in the other medium's thoughts on yaoi? (No, seriously. What was the general sentiment towards slash?)

There's a few whiny yaoi-hating fanboys [How I hate them] in the yuri forum, but they are drowned out by more sane people who are either yaoi fans themselves, or who don't have an issue with it (the later usually by the argument that guys coupled means women are free to be coupled with each other. It also helps that several popular yuri mangaka also do yaoi)

Umineko seems neutral on the issue. Some people ship several male characters with each other (which isn't that easy, actually, more female characters again), others ship het. I only have seen grumbling about yaoi fans twice. The yuri pairing gets more people hating, despite a canonical "I love you" from one character, and a couple dozen "I looooveeeeee heerrrr" from the other.

The Touhou fandom, finally, is an odd case, it's the only of the three that is largely male (I'd guess at least 70% guys in the fandom). There's some dislike for yaoi, but there are also some very well known and popular fans that love yaoi, and ship it for Touhou.
That sounds easier than it is: Touhou has a couple dozen female characters, and about three male characters. Two of them only exist in one line in a female characters description. Another runs a shop and exists only in side stories. As you can imagine, shipping them is difficult.
Nevertheless, yaoi material made it even into larger "online-fanzines" the fandom used to put out, and there weren't all that many complaints. But to be fair: Some people DID complain. I personally like the work of the few yaoi shippers. It's adorable!


10) Was it easier or harder to get into a fandom through a medium other than a journaling site?

Easier, only because I find navigating forums a little easier: Seeing 50 topics at once is easier for me than scrolling through a long friend page. But it doesn't matter that much.

11) Which medium do you prefer?

None, I care more for content, less for medium. If LJ hosted the fandoms of three forums in ways that worked for me, while forums wouldn't, I'd be more active in LJ.

LJ, to me, is not the ultimate or perfect way to do fandom, it's just one way. It's not particularly more or less suitable, in my eyes. What really matters is WHAT is discussed.