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Let's talk about word choice.
Once upon a time there was a wank on it, but for the life of me I can't remember what the life threatening issues were (it might've been something about tentacles and Hermione), or I'd link it for your snorting things up your nose pleasure (within was the link to THE most HI-larious bad!fic I have EVER read). But wanks come around about every 7 months, 4 days, and 3.2 hours, so don't worry your noggins, kids; you'll be seeing it soon enough. Anyway, we are only concerned with the end result, which was really nothing like the following, but it's how most wanks end up looking to me, so here you go:
Person With Anime Name A: *mocks* The words you use are too big for your fics!
Person With Clever Apathetic Phrase For Name B: You just aren't smart enough to read me! [*is emo*]
FANDOM_WANK: Person With Anime Name A's wee!vocabulary! *mockety-mock*
FANDOM_WANK: Shitmanfuck, Person A's one of ours!
Person A: Yes, the words Person B uses sound too intellectual for the average intellect of her fic, mock her, mock her!
FANDOM_WANK: Wait, we're mocking people who use big words now?
FANDOM_WANK: OMG, WHAT ARE WE MOCKING? LET'S GET IT STRAIGHT, PEOPLE!
FANDOM_WANK: Or not. *mock mock mocking*, which occasionally ends in smocking, after which we all end up with cute little pinafores.
[Transcriber's Note: was that a place for emo? Did I get it right?]
So anyway the wank is not the point; the point isn't even those crazy kids at F_W, nor even their smocking needles.
The point is word choice. I felt like poking Person A with a firm needle of repartee (© Jane Eyre omg!), but I actually knew what Person A meant. Every once in a while I'll be reading a fic and I'll stumble onto a word--a word that isn't necessarily uncommon, but a word that makes me say, "Oh. I just know Author had her thesaurus out for this one," and not in a "what a way to flex your vocab" way, but in a "that was completely unnecessary; she should've used a simpler word" way. That is, the word, which wouldn't've caused me to bat an eyelash in a more sophisticated piece, draws attention like a sore thumb because the rest of the piece (conceptually, structurally, grammatically, whatever) doesn't quite...live up to the occasional bursts of elevated vocabulary.
I think it happens a lot with new writers and especially young writers and also bad writers. Some people with a smaller vocabulary might be deciding to spice up their piece with a couple of words they either a) don't know, b) understand but aren't familiar with how to use, c) rarely hear or see. The result might be a relatively even tone, voice, style of the piece, until you get to those particular words. Again, they might not be particularly complex or unusual words, just words that stand out as a little more...advanced than the rest.
But I use the thesaurus ALL THE TIME, and not just when I can't think of a word...I use it when I want to find a word with a certain flavor, and sometimes the word I choose is also "more advanced" than the word I would've chosen on my own. Also, I freely admit that I am one of those writers who has a small vocabulary and tries to spice up her writing with a thesaurus and words I might not normally use in ordinary conversation. In one fic I actually used words that I did not know (something I'd never done before. I looked them up in the dictionary and then googled around to see how they were used in various sentences before I used them, but before that, I had had no clue what the words meant).
The thing is, I think it's possible to use a word you didn't know before, or hadn't used before, or have rarely see, and not have it feel out of place, not have it break the style, tone, voice etc. What I really want to ask is, "how does one achieve this?" But I really already have my answer: I read and weigh and experiment and pick the word that feels right to me. Sometimes it's the common word I came up with right off the bat; sometimes it's the word in the thesaurus I might know but wouldn't have lighted on in weeks of thinking, sometimes it's even a word I'm a little uncertain of and have to go double-check the meaning of before I use it (and that one time, it was words I didn't know at all!)
But what I'm interested in is the attitudes towards this. Do you use a thesaurus, how much, do you like using it, does it feel like cheating, do you only use it because you can't *think* of a word, or do you use it because you have a word you could use but it just doesn't have the right flavor? Do you ever hold off on using the thesaurus because you feel it might stilt your speech? Do you use a thesaurus on purpose to stilt your speech? Do you use words you're uncertain of, or don't know? Do you ever pull back from using a word because you feel it's something whoever's reading might not know, even though it's a word is something you feel like you might use in everyday conversation? Have you ever had it happen that someone says, "Whoa, showing off your vocab!" when you used a word you thought was pretty common? Do you ever use a word *expecting* that most won't know what it means?
(When you read fanfic, do you ever come across words you don't know? Do you ever go look them up afterwards?)
All the above was just supposed to be one point under the general idea of "word choice," but I had difficulty expressing myself, sorry. I wish someone very clever would come in after me and boil these big posts down to three neat little four-lined paragraphs, because I'm way too lazy to do it.)
One of the questions I have relates to my last question about research: what about word research? How often do you research just looking for a specific word? I mentioned my plate episode, when I wanted to find another word for "ceramic" to reference what the plate is made of. Do people often go hunting for such specific words? And if you were going to write a fic with say, a big medical problem in it, is learning lots of vocabulary along the way something you do? And would you use the words you learned in the fic, even if most people wouldn't know their meanings?
Also, how concerned are you with word choice? Do you just write whatever comes out of you; do you do that but then go back to replace some words with better words, do you end "settling" when you can't find the exact word you want, how long do you hunt for the proper words?
I'm just interested in how writers approach the words they use. Which when you think about it, is really the most basic thing to writing there is, which is maybe why I have so many questions but am finding it difficult to state my point succinctly. I'd love to hear anyone's and everyone's thoughts on it.
Person With Anime Name A: *mocks* The words you use are too big for your fics!
Person With Clever Apathetic Phrase For Name B: You just aren't smart enough to read me! [*is emo*]
FANDOM_WANK: Person With Anime Name A's wee!vocabulary! *mockety-mock*
FANDOM_WANK: Shitmanfuck, Person A's one of ours!
Person A: Yes, the words Person B uses sound too intellectual for the average intellect of her fic, mock her, mock her!
FANDOM_WANK: Wait, we're mocking people who use big words now?
FANDOM_WANK: OMG, WHAT ARE WE MOCKING? LET'S GET IT STRAIGHT, PEOPLE!
FANDOM_WANK: Or not. *mock mock mocking*, which occasionally ends in smocking, after which we all end up with cute little pinafores.
[Transcriber's Note: was that a place for emo? Did I get it right?]
So anyway the wank is not the point; the point isn't even those crazy kids at F_W, nor even their smocking needles.
The point is word choice. I felt like poking Person A with a firm needle of repartee (© Jane Eyre omg!), but I actually knew what Person A meant. Every once in a while I'll be reading a fic and I'll stumble onto a word--a word that isn't necessarily uncommon, but a word that makes me say, "Oh. I just know Author had her thesaurus out for this one," and not in a "what a way to flex your vocab" way, but in a "that was completely unnecessary; she should've used a simpler word" way. That is, the word, which wouldn't've caused me to bat an eyelash in a more sophisticated piece, draws attention like a sore thumb because the rest of the piece (conceptually, structurally, grammatically, whatever) doesn't quite...live up to the occasional bursts of elevated vocabulary.
I think it happens a lot with new writers and especially young writers and also bad writers. Some people with a smaller vocabulary might be deciding to spice up their piece with a couple of words they either a) don't know, b) understand but aren't familiar with how to use, c) rarely hear or see. The result might be a relatively even tone, voice, style of the piece, until you get to those particular words. Again, they might not be particularly complex or unusual words, just words that stand out as a little more...advanced than the rest.
But I use the thesaurus ALL THE TIME, and not just when I can't think of a word...I use it when I want to find a word with a certain flavor, and sometimes the word I choose is also "more advanced" than the word I would've chosen on my own. Also, I freely admit that I am one of those writers who has a small vocabulary and tries to spice up her writing with a thesaurus and words I might not normally use in ordinary conversation. In one fic I actually used words that I did not know (something I'd never done before. I looked them up in the dictionary and then googled around to see how they were used in various sentences before I used them, but before that, I had had no clue what the words meant).
The thing is, I think it's possible to use a word you didn't know before, or hadn't used before, or have rarely see, and not have it feel out of place, not have it break the style, tone, voice etc. What I really want to ask is, "how does one achieve this?" But I really already have my answer: I read and weigh and experiment and pick the word that feels right to me. Sometimes it's the common word I came up with right off the bat; sometimes it's the word in the thesaurus I might know but wouldn't have lighted on in weeks of thinking, sometimes it's even a word I'm a little uncertain of and have to go double-check the meaning of before I use it (and that one time, it was words I didn't know at all!)
But what I'm interested in is the attitudes towards this. Do you use a thesaurus, how much, do you like using it, does it feel like cheating, do you only use it because you can't *think* of a word, or do you use it because you have a word you could use but it just doesn't have the right flavor? Do you ever hold off on using the thesaurus because you feel it might stilt your speech? Do you use a thesaurus on purpose to stilt your speech? Do you use words you're uncertain of, or don't know? Do you ever pull back from using a word because you feel it's something whoever's reading might not know, even though it's a word is something you feel like you might use in everyday conversation? Have you ever had it happen that someone says, "Whoa, showing off your vocab!" when you used a word you thought was pretty common? Do you ever use a word *expecting* that most won't know what it means?
(When you read fanfic, do you ever come across words you don't know? Do you ever go look them up afterwards?)
All the above was just supposed to be one point under the general idea of "word choice," but I had difficulty expressing myself, sorry. I wish someone very clever would come in after me and boil these big posts down to three neat little four-lined paragraphs, because I'm way too lazy to do it.)
One of the questions I have relates to my last question about research: what about word research? How often do you research just looking for a specific word? I mentioned my plate episode, when I wanted to find another word for "ceramic" to reference what the plate is made of. Do people often go hunting for such specific words? And if you were going to write a fic with say, a big medical problem in it, is learning lots of vocabulary along the way something you do? And would you use the words you learned in the fic, even if most people wouldn't know their meanings?
Also, how concerned are you with word choice? Do you just write whatever comes out of you; do you do that but then go back to replace some words with better words, do you end "settling" when you can't find the exact word you want, how long do you hunt for the proper words?
I'm just interested in how writers approach the words they use. Which when you think about it, is really the most basic thing to writing there is, which is maybe why I have so many questions but am finding it difficult to state my point succinctly. I'd love to hear anyone's and everyone's thoughts on it.
no subject
Did you know that word before you used it? And dude, I don't even remember seeing it, although I too almost always look up the words I don't know.
Yes, but it won't come out until it's marginally pretty, unless I absolutely force it.
This is interesting to me, because as soon as my pen touches paper, or fingers the keyboard, it all comes tumbling out, pretty or unpretty unlike. It's only when I'm utterly fixated on making every single word perfectly pretty that it doesn't come out like water.
I always have to do a run-through to get rid of duplicates. Somebody peers at somebody in one paragraph, and then there they are peering again two paragraphs later. It's really bizarre which words get stuck to my fingers.
I was thinking about this when I was compiling all the posts I wanted to do about writing, but I didn't know when to bring it up. I guess on this one would've been good! What's most amusing to me is when I see a published author doing this--so obviously stuck on a word, and so obviously not even noticing it. I tend to use "flatly" and "blankly" way too often to modify the word "said." And isn't excessive adverbage a no no? Oh, maybe that's another post.
Two years from now I'll snap my fingers and go, "Of course!"
Ha! That is how I write poetry. I have a poem I have been writing for 7.5 years now.
no subject
Did you know that word before you used it?
Yup, it shows up in a poem by T.S. Eliot or Edward Lear or somebody.
And isn't excessive adverbage a no no?
Hogwash. I've been compiling a Word file called Found Writing Tips, and one of my favourites is from
I have a poem I have been writing for 7.5 years now.
{g} I have some original stories like that. I've learned to be philosophical: Now is not its time; and yet its time will come!
no subject
And anyone familiar with the Muses would know the word, of course.
no subject
no subject
Far be it from me to dispute
Certainly, there are some who say the less adjectives and adverbs the better. I agree, they're full of shit. However, I think the general...uh, prejudice? (should turn to the thesaurus now but WHATEVER) against them has arisen from the tendency of young/new/bad writers to use five adjectives when one more-to-the-point one would've sufficed, or to use an adverb when a sharper, stronger, more active verb would've been enough.
In The Idiot, Dostoevsky uses adverbs a lot to describe how the main character says or acts, and it often comes at the end of the sentences (which is possibly my translation). Still, the result is one of surprise; the character makes a remark that you read as sarcasm, but it turns out he has said it sincerely--the character is continually turning the dime on expectation this way.
An example, anyway, of how important something like an adverb can be . . . it would just be difficult to pull that kind of thing off in such a regular way, the way Dostoevsky did in that novel. I've tried it myself and the reaction with most people I showed the piece to was . . . "why were the adverbs so funky?" Ha!